Pastelland Forum

Anteroinen wrote:Well, it makes sense, right? Submachine was originally this neat and complex thing, before the corruption started. That is where you'll find the answers: in the beginning not in the end.

Perhaps going back to or at least make some sort of connection to Sub_1?

I been waiting forever to see how the Basement even fits in the main series beside having the first note of Mur.

They are dead. We saw their bodies in their tombs. We learned their stories and discovered their purposes. Their story is wrapped up, now its time for us to wrap up the player's story which will happen in Sub10.

Agreed. Sub10 should be focused on two last main things: Player and Machine itself.

But I still think we will find last Murtaugh word in Exit, like we did in Basement. Even if his story is ended.

And will we meet LIVE BEING at the end? Mateusz found exit how to show us Mur and Liz without showing live humans... But what about Einstein, for example?

- ak - wrote:

Anteroinen wrote:Well, it makes sense, right? Submachine was originally this neat and complex thing, before the corruption started. That is where you'll find the answers: in the beginning not in the end.

Perhaps going back to or at least make some sort of connection to Sub_1?

I been waiting forever to see how the Basement even fits in the main series beside having the first note of Mur.

Me too. I would be sad if finally we found that the Basement has no more meaning than a random location the Player got thrown into at the beginning.

Sublevel 102 wrote:And will we meet LIVE BEING at the end?

like Sub7's plants?

OnyxIonVortex wrote:

Sublevel 102 wrote:And will we meet LIVE BEING at the end?

like Sub7's plants? :P

But I meant live BEING. Not live FORM. :P

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/Living+being

I know, I know what you mean, I'm just kidding

I thought about the possibility that the voice could be Shiva. Plotwise, it would make sense, but I hope it's Murtaugh. Murtaugh and Elizabeth are characters created for Submachine. Within the confines of the story a cultish religion was created to worship them. Shiva is an existing god in a religion that exists outside of the submachine universe. Having Shiva become a character within submachine either makes the story blasphemous or religous. That makes me a little uneasy, so I hope that voice is our first auditory interaction with Murtaugh and not Shiva.

I disagree with the people saying since we found Mur and Liz's tombs our interaction with them is over. We the player live within our own time, and it's been established that Mur and Liz have been dead for centuries. The only explanation I can think of for this is we've been interacting with sentient ghosts the entire series. Mur has said things and left notes throughout the series making it seem like we're seeing evidence of him at different points before and after his second enlightenment. I believe he is trying to use us to reach the core and try to reverse the chaos he created. Liz seems to have reached enlightenment before Mur, but as an inhabitant of the subachine she can't help him in the same way we can as outsiders. Shiva already showed Murtaugh the future and it's a happy ending, so we know we can't mess anything up.

My biggest question is what do people who have reached enlightenment actually see? They can't see people or details of specific layers unless they "lose focus", so what does the 8th layer look like? At first I thought it was along the same lines as "the 4th dimension is time", and didn't really exist in the same way as the other dimensions, but now I'm not sure. All the time warping stuff always confused the living shit out of me because I firmly believe that time travel is impossible in any iteration. I can't suspend my disbelief enough for it to even make sci-fi sense.

Mateusz must love reading our theories because we're always so far off the mark. I even venture to say he reads theories and deliberately avoids having the story resemble any of them.

gemini wrote:

But what about Einstein, for example?

Pretty sure the cat is dead too...

Yes. If we don't consider time travels.
And maybe more special forces of this animal. :)

Other thing that bugs me is the relation between the Loop and the Knot, they are said to be similar and both share the same porpuse.

Sublevel 102 wrote:

gemini wrote:

But what about Einstein, for example?

Pretty sure the cat is dead too...

Yes. If we don't consider time travels.
And maybe more special forces of this animal.

The cult more or less dismissed him though. They even referred to him as "the animal". It certainly doesn't seem like it, though they blatantly accept that he switched layers.

I was just pondering the new information, and I think I managed to connect some dots.

- Do you see it now?

- Yes... How is it even possible? They're interlocking perfectly...

- Who needs god when you have architects like that, right?

- But why the boundaries. Why this particular shape?

- The idea is to give you the glimpse of the plan. Just a glimpse. Seeing it in all it's glory would blind your mind.

The Fourth Dynasty at the peak of it's cultural and technological development was able to create first man-made submachine structure. That was around the beginning of twentieth century and is now considered the birthdate of the outer rim.

Right now due to corossion, collapse and spontaneous growth of the outer rim the plan is almost unrecognizable.

The Plan, so far as we know, refers to the Core submachines, spread out over the 7 main layers. The use of the term "architects" implies that the Plan is not a naturally occurring phenomenon. These submachines were not built by Mankind, and the architects note implies that it was not a deity either. Since it was neither man nor god, the only remaining explanation is that the plan was designed by a computer. My guess is that the Plan was created by the computer that exceeded human brainpower. The humans, wishing to prove themselves equal to the computer, tried to create the root, and sparked the uncontrolled growth of the outer rim. The defense systems were then created to stop anyone from trying to create another submachine, by exiling them to the 8th layer.