Okay, finally caught up with just about all of the discussion.
More new members, I see; welcome!
SoLost wrote:I thought about the possibility that the voice could be Shiva. Plotwise, it would make sense, but I hope it's Murtaugh. Murtaugh and Elizabeth are characters created for Submachine. Within the confines of the story a cultish religion was created to worship them. Shiva is an existing god in a religion that exists outside of the submachine universe. Having Shiva become a character within submachine either makes the story blasphemous or religous. That makes me a little uneasy, so I hope that voice is our first auditory interaction with Murtaugh and not Shiva.
I agree, that bothers me a bit as well.
AK wrote:The Karma is the FOUNDATION of everything we see in the realm of Submachine. Even the machines are of karmic energy. That's why Submachine grow and expand, using Karmic Energy as it source. That's why we see green energy lines in Sub_Universe AND Sub_3 at the end! That's why almost everything are (or were) collapsing because of the destructive karma emitted by Murtaugh, even if such things were unintentional on his ends. This was never the tale about Murtaugh's Revenge. This is about Murtaugh's Enlightenment and Repentance. This is about Shiva (or dare I say... Submachine?) wanting Murtaugh to reunite the people with the Submachine by giving him the power to be in seven layers at the same time and thus, giving him the opportunity to experience Enlightenment and see the Plan for what it truly is. This is about the conflict of the soul with the mind, both people and Submachine. Very appropriate given the constant themes found in many Mateusz's works.
I agree completely.
Vortex wrote:btw, about this note:
Quote:
- How is it possible, that people are still coming through the loop and trying to turn off the defense systems? After all these years...
- What would you have me do. Destroy his creation? Destroy the whole section?
- I don't know... Maybe...
- You're talking about destroying our history. What next, book burning?
- No, of course not. But maybe... A sign? That it's no longer necessary to shut down the defenses?
- And what about those in the eighth layer?
- I stand corrected...
that means that many of our predecessors were still trying and failing to shut down the DefSys when it was no longer necessary, right? It talks about "destroying history" so that means Murtaugh must have died at that time. Then, if we are the first person to succeed in shutting it down... who were we talking to at the end of Sub6? It said it came from mur@lab, but he was dead... does it mean it's an impostor?
I interpreted it more as a space/time anomaly that Murtaugh (accidentally?) created. The note mentions that
people are still coming through the loop and trying to turn off the defense systems which suggests that people have escaped the loop and re-encountered the events from sub 4-6 with the possibility of events that came before and after as well.
So who were we talking to at the end of sub6?
I believe nobody. That was only time looping in those areas, while in the other subs it ran as it normally would (whatever manner that may be – we don't know). We would not have been talking with Murtaugh, as that would imply that it would have been the same person turning off the defense systems: something that would have probably have been mentioned if that was the case.
This is, of course, one possible interpretation of many, which I may expand upon.
RuloCore wrote:Mateusz I want lots of spaceship white-padded rooms and artificial light and metal machines and computer-like structures and futuristic installations and virtual environments for #Submachine10 please
I would actually be rather disappointed if Mateusz decided to create Sub10 like a futuristic spaceship in a sci-fi movie. The way machinery/technology is integrated like in the previous subs would more appropriate.
Vortex wrote:The problem, I think, is that we haven't seen how the Submachine's "real world" is, it even might have been completely absorbed into the Subnet.
I was wondering that earlier actually. Is the "real world" part of the submachine? I'd like to bring particular attention to the Bamboo Town: that could be anywhere – Earth included...
Gemini wrote:They are dead. We saw their bodies in their tombs. We learned their stories and discovered their purposes. Their story is wrapped up, now its time for us to wrap up the player's story which will happen in Sub10.
Yes, I don't think that we'll be hearing much more about Murtaugh and Liz in Sub10; we got a reasonably clear recount of their story in Sub9.
I have had the impression, however, that throughout these discussions, we have assumed that Murtaugh and Liz have been dead throughout the whole series. As Ancient Crystal put it:
Ancient Crystal wrote:What happened to the idea of the pre-sub8 interactions with Mur and Liz being real-time, and some form of jump in time occuring between those and the events of The Plan?
We could have been directly behind Murtaugh and Liz until we entered the chaos of portals within portals and changed direction of, "everything," possibly transporting us through time 700 or so years into the future. We did see several versions of the Sanctuary pre- and post- invasion after all.
I don't think we can dismiss this possibility yet...
ThunderDasher wrote:Its song feels very nostalgic.
Indeed.
– – – – – – –
I'd better not add anything else in case I go over the character limit (60000)
....
Balance is imperative; without it, total collapse and destruction is imminent.
